(SOUNDBITE OF FILM, "TEENAGE SEX AND DEATH AT CAMP MIASMA")
GILLIAN ANDERSON: (As Billy) Camp Miasma, it wasn't about cultural depictions of monstrosity or gender trouble or any of that stuff.
JOEL ROSE, HOST:
That is fictional scream queen Billy Presley in this year's horror comedy "Teenage Sex And Death At Camp Miasma." Presley is telling an aspiring filmmaker not to overthink the classic horror franchise that made her a star.
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ANDERSON: (As Billy) It was about two very simple things - flesh and fluids.
ROSE: "Camp Miasma" is also about flesh and fluids, but it is also explicitly about queerness, reading queerness in the horror genre and watching horror as a queer viewer. In fact, the horror genre and queerness share a deep connection. To get into it, I am joined by two horror fanatics - ALL THINGS CONSIDERED producer Mallory Yu, who helps oversee our arts coverage, and Weekend Edition producer Ryan Benk. Welcome to you both.
RYAN BENK, BYLINE: Hey there.
MALLORY YU, BYLINE: Hello.
ROSE: Let's take a step back here. What are the roots of these connections between queerness and horror?
BENK: For simplicity, I think you can say that horror has always been both an outcast and outlaw genre in general, that is that it's kind of always lived outside of the so-called mainstream of culture. It's not well represented during award seasons but also viewed with disdain by prevailing puritanical cultures. But also as far back as, like, Mary Shelley's "Frankenstein"...
(SOUNDBITE OF FILM, "FRANKENSTEIN")
COLIN CLIVE: (As Henry Frankenstein) It's alive. It's alive. It's alive.
BENK: ...Oscar Wilde's "Picture Of Dorian Gray"...
(SOUNDBITE OF FILM, "THE PICTURE OF DORIAN GRAY")
HURD HATFIELD: (As Dorian Gray) Only the picture could change, and I could be always what I am now.
BENK: ...The stories themselves have spotlighted the outcast as main character. It's put you in the shoes of people or monsters that society views as lesser or even dangerous. And if there's one thing that queer folks know about, it's about being a pariah. It is also, by far, more complicated than that (laughter). Not all representations of queer people have been fair or accurate. But on balance, it's just a genre that welcomes all of us misfit toys.
YU: Yes, yes, to all of that. And I would also add that sort of from a human perspective, it is pretty horrifying already to live in a society that rejects and marginalizes you and sometimes even criminalizes you. You know, queer people don't have to imagine how terrifying it can be to hide this huge facet of yourself that people think is monstrous and constantly worry about whether you'll be found out. And I think horror gives us a really good avenue to explore what happens when you might deny your own passions, what it feels like to be considered monstrous outside of your identity.
ROSE: Would you say this has been, like, a fruitful or a positive connection? Can one of you expand a little bit on this bond for me?
YU: Yeah. I mean, it's complicated, I would say. It's a complicated connection because, like Ryan said, these depictions aren't always fair or accurate. You know, there's plenty of horror movies where queerness itself is monstrous. You know, I'm thinking of movies like "Silence Of The Lambs"...
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TED LEVINE: (As Jame Gumb) It rubs the lotion on its skin, or else it gets the hose again.
YU: ...Where there's a serial killer who many consider to be trans or who could be read as trans, who's targeting women to complete ostensibly an own transformation into a woman...
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ANTHONY HOPKINS: (As Dr. Hannibal Lecter) The significance of the moth is change. Caterpillar into chrysalis or pupa and, from thence, into beauty. Our Billy wants to change too.
YU: ...Or even like "Sleepaway Camp," where the main antagonist is driven to murder because they grew up as a gender that is incongruent with their identity.
(SOUNDBITE OF FILM, "SLEEPAWAY CAMP")
DESIREE GOULD: (As Aunt Martha) Yes, I've always dreamed of a little girl just like you. I mean, we already have a boy, so another one simply would not do.
YU: And, you know, of course, there's, like, metaphorical merit to this, this sort of, like, violent catharsis of a trans person who has had to live in a gender that they don't identify as. But again, it's really complicated.
BENK: Right. To add on top of it that, I think, over time queer folks, like we have with specific words or epithets that people use - yeah...
YU: I mean, saying (ph) the word queer itself.
BENK: ...The word queer itself, yeah, exactly - we've kind of reclaimed some of these characters and have decided, you know what? OK, so yeah, I am the monster. And what? And I look really good doing it so...
YU: That's right.
BENK: ...You know (laughter).
ROSE: Can you give me some notable examples of when queerness was the subtext in a film?
BENK: There are so many examples, especially through the '80s, but I mean, I have a couple that are top of mind, first being "Nightmare On Elm Street 2: Freddy's Revenge."
YU: Yes.
(SOUNDBITE OF FILM, "A NIGHTMARE ON ELM STREET PART 2: FREDDY'S REVENGE")
ROBERT ENGLUND: (As Freddy Krueger) I need you, Jesse. We got special work to do here, you and me.
BENK: With modern hindsight, it seems kind of impossible to miss, you know, the idea that it is subtext at all. But at the time, even the film's protagonist, played by actor Mark Patton, didn't know what he was getting himself into. His character, Jesse, is stalked by Robert Englund's Freddy Krueger through gym showers, a shirtless frenemy's bedroom and even a gay bar. The film hinges on Jesse's fear of what is, quote, "inside him"...
(SOUNDBITE OF FILM, "A NIGHTMARE ON ELM STREET PART 2: FREDDY'S REVENGE")
MARK PATTON: (As Jesse Walsh) He's inside me. He's inside me, and he wants to take me again.
BENK: ...A barely veiled reference to struggling with coming out. And then, of course, you have films like Joel Schumacher's "Lost Boys"...
YU: Yes.
BENK: ...Where all these young male vampires are dressed up in leather garb and crop tops and playfully dancing around homoeroticism in this camp and cheeky way.
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KIEFER SUTHERLAND: (As David) Initiation's over, Michael. It's time to join the club.
(SOUNDBITE OF ANIMAL ROARING)
BENK: No one's obviously gay, right, Mallory?
YU: I mean, those dangling earrings are kind of a hint (laughter).
BENK: But - (laughter) yes. But Schumacher was, and it was clear that he was drawing on a very specific subset of queer representation.
YU: Well, since Ryan beat me to the punch on "Lost Boys," I'll bring up 1994's "Interview With A Vampire" here, the one with Tom Cruise and Brad Pitt, because while nobody is explicitly textually gay in that movie, it is famously a horror movie about a toxic gay couple...
BENK: (Laughter).
YU: ...And their inability to parent their horrible child.
(SOUNDBITE OF FILM, "INTERVIEW WITH THE VAMPIRE: THE VAMPIRE CHRONICLES")
KIRSTEN DUNST: (As Claudia, shouting) Which one of you made me the way I am?
TOM CRUISE: (As Lestat) What you are - a vampire gone insane that pollutes its own bed?
YU: Can I just say, vampires are so gay, even when they're not gay at all.
BENK: And these days, they are...
YU: They are, yeah.
BENK: ...Explicitly gay.
ROSE: When you look at where queer horror is today, what are some of the common themes or tropes that you're seeing?
BENK: I mean, I think queer horror today is not only more free to explore queerness in general, but to drill down into the modern nuance of queer identity and, like, the battles that we are fighting today, which are, you know, admittedly very different than they were, you know, 40 years ago. For example, I'm struck by films that explore the banality of homophobia. You know, today's homophobia isn't necessarily as overt as it used to be, and it's usually shrugged off until it surfaces as violence.
YU: Right.
BENK: And there's a film from this year, "Leviticus," that's about these two young boys who fall in love in this Australian bush town. It's kind of sort of a Romeo and Romeo story where the parents are either completely checked out or casually homophobic. Yet when they find out that these two teens are in love, they look to heal them with the help of a noxious religious leader.
(SOUNDBITE OF FILM, "LEVITICUS")
MIA WASIKOWSKA: (As Arlene) I think Ryan got in your head...
JOE BIRD: (As Naim) No, it's not that.
WASIKOWSKA: (As Arlene) ...And made you believe in something that's not really you.
BIRD: (As Naim) What did he do to me?
WASIKOWSKA: (As Arlene) Naim.
BIRD: (As Naim) OK, to us?
WASIKOWSKA: (As Arlene) Naim.
BIRD: (As Naim) Surely, you know something about it.
WASIKOWSKA: (As Arlene) Naim, stop.
BENK: And director Adrian Chiarella told us that he was inspired to make the movie after seeing a so-called resurgence in homophobia following Australia's vote to approve same-sex marriage. And "Leviticus" reminds us that homophobia and things like conversion therapy are not only still out there, but they always have the possibility to grow again. And I think that is a scary thought.
YU: Yeah, like, I really loved how "Leviticus" captured the horror of religious trauma on queer kids in a way that I haven't necessarily seen as overtly as this.
BENK: Yeah.
YU: I'll also say, to end us on a lighter note, that I love that horror movies now can just casually have gay characters without necessarily being about their gayness. Like, "Bodies Bodies Bodies" was a recent one that I enjoyed, where it's just a group of friends who are getting together for a hurricane party, and everything goes awry.
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AMANDLA STENBERG: (As Sophie) If you draw the piece of paper that has the X on it, you are the murderer. And you have to keep it a secret.
CHASE SUI WONDERS: (As Emma) Guys, I get so stressed out every time we play this. Someone always ends up crying.
YU: The main character is a new addition, and her queerness adds a layer to the relationships unspooled on screen. But the movie is just about these, like, toxic people kind of being toxic together, and their queerness is just another layer, which is really nice. I want to see more movies like "Leviticus," but I also want to see more movies like "Bodies Bodies Bodies."
BENK: Absolutely.
ROSE: Thank you both for helping me see some of these connections that I had never put together before. That was NPR's Mallory Yu and Ryan Benk. Thanks for joining us.
YU: Always a pleasure.
BENK: Thank you so much.
(SOUNDBITE OF MUSIC) Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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